One IDE to rule them all....

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One IDE to rule them all....

Postby atxpython » Sun Sep 11, 2016 3:18 pm

Alright...
So I know this question comes up a lot on programming forums, but its always fun to talk about.

What IDE do you feel is the best for Python?
Could be a paid app or a free app.

The reason I ask - I'm new to Python and still trying to explore some tools that could make my workflow easier.

The one I've used the most is IDLE... Which seems to get a lot of crap from developers online.
But honestly, I don't find it that terrible.
Sure... There are certainly some features it is lacking, but oh well, it was free and it works.

I've tried Atom, Sublime and PyCharm.
So far nothing has really spoken to me.
PyCharm was the nicest (in my opinion), but there was a lot going on with it - I found myself spending more time reading about the features of the IDE than I did actually using it.
And I probably didn't give Atom or Sublime enough of a fair chance.

What are you using to develop your Python programs?
What is the "industry standard"? (if there is such a thing)

I appreciate your input!
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Re: One IDE to rule them all....

Postby metulburr » Sun Sep 11, 2016 3:29 pm

There really is not an industry standard. There are many IDE's because there are so many tastes. Many IDE's charge a cost for the software, such as PyCharm and Sublime. However they provide a free software version. Whether it be a popup that asks you to buy it very 5th save file, or limited features, etc. Some are 100% free. There are a ridiculous number of IDE's to choose from https://wiki.python.org/moin/Integrated ... vironments

I dont use an IDE. I use Vim. Which is basically a text editor, and i execute scripts from the terminal. Then i use tmux to split the terminal in two so i have an execution terminal, and a vim terminal. Such as shown below...
vim_screen.png
vim_screen.png (114.08 KiB) Viewed 1087 times

I use vim a lot because its already installed by default, or very easy to install on a linux server. And there is no real way to use a GUI IDE on a server in real time. And to use an IDE locally to modify a file, then FTP/SCP it to the server, to find that you typod one line, and have to FTP/SCP it back again...is really redundant. Much easier to just use Vim and modify it on the server. That in turn also lead me to use Vim locally as my IDE too. I also reinstall my linux every 6 months - 2 years. I get sick of reinstalling IDE's and configuring them to the way i want them. ITs much easier to use my single .vimrc config file and be done with it.

I stopped using IDLE a long time ago. IDLE is written in python/tkinter. Which if you write a tkinter app and use IDLE to write it in, the two mainloop's can conflict with each other. I have had other problems with pygame and IDLE as well. This is why i stopped using IDLE. However most people use IDLE because it comes packaged with python in Windows...and most people use the default IDE. Because of this some people dont understand that you can run python without IDLE. Some people mix up IDE and IDLE and think they are the same. An IDE in general also inhibits new people from understanding whats going on behind the scenes. Thats why i always suggest to new users to start with a text editor and a command prompt/terminal.

I like both pycharm and sublime. I used them a long time ago for a period. I just prefer simplicity of Vim.
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Re: One IDE to rule them all....

Postby Ofnuts » Sun Sep 11, 2016 4:54 pm

metulburr wrote:And there is no real way to use a GUI IDE on a server in real time. And to use an IDE locally to modify a file, then FTP/SCP it to the server, to find that you typod one line, and have to FTP/SCP it back again...is really redundant.

*cough*

I use KDE and with a simple setup:
  • its Dolphin file explorer will fairly transparently navigate the file systems of any server on which I have SSH access,
  • the companion Kate editor will transparently edit files from the server.
  • both Dolphin and Kate windows can include a terminal and if this is a terminal on your local system its current directory will also track the directory in the explorer (Dolphin), or the directory of the currently edited file (Kate).
  • kdiff3 can compare files or whole directories between local or remote systems (or between two remote ones...)
  • filelight will show you a nice graphic representation of disk usage on local or remote systems
  • and from what I understand, other KDE tools will also use transparently (translucently if you factor in load time on slow links) remote files: gwenview (images), okular (PDF and other documents...)

In my professional life, every new project means looking at stuff on a dozen servers or so, the whole thing is incredibly efficient, it runs circles around colleagues stuck on Windows with PuTTY/WinSCP.

And I never have to use Vim.
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Re: One IDE to rule them all....

Postby wavic » Sun Sep 11, 2016 5:18 pm

I am kind of a minimalist person. Linux makes me love the simple things. One tool for the job which can't do anything else. But always works as expected. However I've used Geany, Sublime Text 3, PyCharm Com., Ninja IDE and Atom. All of those works. But as you mentions in the post, one may spend hours just learning the interface. I am pointing to PyCharm. Most of the time I use Geany as this one was first one I've used.
But vim is my favorite because of a simple reason. Productivity. And can be an excellent "IDE". Here is why
Last edited by wavic on Sun Sep 11, 2016 7:44 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: One IDE to rule them all....

Postby metulburr » Sun Sep 11, 2016 5:19 pm

@Ofnutz
I retract my statement that there are no other options.

Ive used FileZilla at one point, but sometimes it would randomly not connect to my servers or fail at some transfers. I said screw it and used SCP to do it manually. I assume I would have similar problems with an IDE. I still would prefer Vim. As well as SCP for copying.

it runs circles around colleagues stuck on Windows with PuTTY/WinSCP

I was meaning more from a point of linux locally. From my experience, window users prefer GUI anyways.

And I never have to use Vim.

I am not stuck using Vim. I like Vim...and prefer it over GUI IDE's. I even use it locally for development.
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Re: One IDE to rule them all....

Postby ichabod801 » Sun Sep 11, 2016 7:09 pm

I used to use UltraEdit on Windows, but when I was forced to move to Linux I switched to Sublime. I'm not entirely happy with Sublime, but it works just fine after I displayed some adaptability. I really did not like vim or emacs. I don't do much on servers, so I haven't needed anything more than nano in those contexts.
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Re: One IDE to rule them all....

Postby ackmondual » Wed Sep 21, 2016 8:31 pm

There's a whole list of them here.....
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1047 ... -in-python

I myself have only ever used IDLE 2.x, IDLE 3.x, and Atom. All 3 for Windows, but last one also on Linux.
IDLE isn't a bad start. It has some of the more useful stuff... especially compared to plain ol' Notepad... bracket matching, smart indent, colored fonts.

IDLE 2.x has an annoying memory leak where if you repeatedly run a program without closing out processes via Windows Task Manager, you'll run out of RAM.
I regret not doing that one project in Python 3.x, but we're stuck with it for now.

IDLE 3.x addresses that memory leak, but you can't have it run Python 2.x code... only 3.x

Both IDLE's have the auto-completion thing where you type in a keyword or known function and it makes suggestions, which is nice.

Atom on Linux was a joy to use. One thing here that wasn't available on IDLE was it keeps track of the variables used and offers that as part of the auto-complete. For example, if you have a variable called num_elves, you can type in the 1st two letters and this will be suggested. Quick, and makes keeping track of variables much easier. I've had errors because I "typo-ed" variable names.

When I delve into more complex stuff, I may want to look into an option with code folding and templates.


BTW, does anybody have definitions for what some of those features are?

Atom on Windows has the annoying thing with using DOS for the command line (I prefer Linux), so as a serious long term solution, I'll need to look into alternatives for command line (IIRC there was something that lets you use Unix command lines in Windows)



As somebody who has his sights on getting the Red Hat certification, I'll have to know at least a minimal amount of vim. Even though it's still more than I'd prefer to delve into, I'd rather not go beyond that
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Re: One IDE to rule them all....

Postby sparkz_alot » Wed Sep 21, 2016 8:39 pm

There are many IDE's because there are so many tastes. Many IDE's charge a cost for the software, such as PyCharm and Sublime


Don't know about Sublime, but PyCharm has a free community edition :D :D :D
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Re: One IDE to rule them all....

Postby metulburr » Thu Sep 22, 2016 12:13 am

Last i used it, Sublime had a free version. It just would have a popup every Nth save file asking you to buy it. (I modified this to stop, but i wont go there)
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Re: One IDE to rule them all....

Postby wavic » Thu Sep 22, 2016 6:09 am

ackmondual wrote:
.........

BTW, does anybody have definitions for what some of those features are?

Atom on Windows has the annoying thing with using DOS for the command line (I prefer Linux), so as a serious long term solution, I'll need to look into alternatives for command line (IIRC there was something that lets you use Unix command lines in Windows)


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